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-------------------------
Wayne Besen
PO Box 25491
Brooklyn, NY 11202
Neal Boortz sums up my sentiment on the marauding Muslims going nuts over cartoons in Europe. The reason the radical Muslims are always so angry is because they lack the very freedom they are protesting.
Muslim outrage huh. OK ... let's do a little historical review. Just some lowlights:
** Muslims fly commercial airliners into buildings in New York City. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslim officials block the exit where school girls are trying to escape a burning building because their faces were exposed. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims cut off the heads of three teenaged girls on their way to school in Indonesia. A Christian school. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims murder teachers trying to teach Muslim children in Iraq. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims murder over 80 tourists with car bombs outside cafes and hotels in Egypt. No Muslim outrage.
** A Muslim attacks a missionary children's school in India. Kills six. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims slaughter hundreds of children and teachers in Beslan, Russia. Muslims shoot children in the back. No Muslim outrage.
Let's go way back. Muslims kidnap and kill athletes at the Munich Summer Olympics. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims fire rocket-propelled grenades into schools full of children in Israel. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims murder more than 50 commuters in attacks on London subways and busses. Over 700 are injured. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims massacre dozens of innocents at a Passover Seder. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims murder innocent vacationers in Bali. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslim newspapers publish anti-Semitic cartoons. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims are involved, on one side or the other, in almost every one of the 125+ shooting wars around the world. No Muslim outrage.
** Muslims beat the charred bodies of Western civilians with their shoes, then hang them from a bridge. No Muslim outrage.
** Newspapers in Denmark and Norway publish cartoons depicting Mohammed. Muslims are outraged.
It is time we stop making excuses for the violent behavior of radical Islamists. They belong to a brand of Islam that is a danger to the world. Let us hope that moderate Muslims take control and bring the Middle East into the modern world. Once this happens, we won't see absurd protests over cartoons of Mohammed.
20 Comments:
Just like fanatical U.S. fundamentalists, these radicals believe their view of religion should be imposed upon the whole world. This mayhem is just a manifestation of what they see as their right and duty. Sounds all too familiar.
posted by Anonymous, at
2/04/2006 8:43 PM
Yeah, I wish I had a dollar for every fundamentalist evangelical Christian who's hijacked and flown airplanes into Arab world skyscrapers (in peacetime), attacked and beheaded Muslim schoolgirls, etc...
posted by Anonymous, at
2/05/2006 10:51 AM
And anonymous, fundie Christians had a lock on forcing native American children into institutions where they had to renounce their own culture, learn the Bible and be trained in labor to work for white businesses and homes.
Churches in the Bible Belt are still mostly segregated
Fundie Christians are not satisfied with barring gay people from traditional institutions, they want gay people an exception to the protections and access that the Constitution and Bill of Rights guarantees.
And when there is a murderous rampage fueled by anti gay rhetoric that poisons the ears of disaffected youth, you get the Robidas of the world carrying out the lynching duties. The trail of crushed skulls, slashed throats and charred bodies (Scotty Joe Weaver and Billy Jack Gaithers) can be attributed to the constant advertising that reading the Bible is now certification and license to hate gay people enough that the very humanity of gay people is questioned.
posted by Regan, at
2/05/2006 12:33 PM
Re: "Yeah, I wish ...."
The majority of American fundamentalists support the illegal atrocity taking place in Iraq. Iraqi dead now estimated at 250,000. Where is your moral outrage about this and about American fundamentalist support for it?
www.agoracosmopolitan.com/home/Iraq_war.php
posted by Anonymous, at
2/05/2006 12:37 PM
Regarding Islam and Christianity and so-called Christian "atrocities"...
I was at a "fundamentalist evangelical" church the other day (and Regan, this church is in the "Bible belt" (northwest Arkansas, very republican) and there are lots of both black and interracial couples there...I mean SEVERAL of them) where the minister has gone to evangelize (and deliver aid) to Sumatra, the Indonesian island/province hardest hit by the 2004 Boxing Day tsunami.
He has been invited back. He's also been in the house of the governor of Sumatra. This minister said that the governor muslims (MUSLIMS) are asking their leaders to let the Christians in, because (and I copied this down for you):
- The Christian aid agencies are "wiping their tears" (of the villagers, Muslim or whatever religion) - The villagers say the Christian aid groups are helping them bury their dead - They say the Christian aid groups are helping feed these villagers - They say that the Christian aid groups are helping them rebuild their houses, and their lives.
I've seen the slide show of this minister's visit to Sumatra. He spent a lot of time there.
(BTW, this same minister said of a recent AIDS march that we should not forget the marchers are trying to help PEOPLE WHO ARE DYING. (And this minister is very funda-gelical).)
But there are some here who will say: "Oh, we're independent thinkers. And we know he's just making that all up."
Just like we're making it all up that there's any progress at all in Iraq. That the majority of people being killed by our forces are anything but the Islamic terrorists Wayne Besen decries. (Or that these terrorists are the ones largely responsible for killing any innocents.) Or that there's even been any environmental progress in Iraq, etc.
posted by Anonymous, at
2/06/2006 10:18 AM
On the news last night, I heard one of the girating, brainwashed fanatics say, "These cartoons bring shame to Islam!" OK, but incitement to murder and acting like a savage doesn't?? I know we've all had this thought, but I just had to say it.
These people cannot be reasoned with. They (murdering extremists) must simply be killed off. And that's why George W. Bush was re-elected. John Kerry was never able to effectively communicate that he grasped that basic fact.
posted by Chris L., at
2/06/2006 10:57 AM
Comment: "Just like we're making it all up that there's any progress at all in Iraq. That the majority of people being killed by our forces are anything but the Islamic terrorists Wayne Besen decries."
This is true and a seperate issue. I oppose the mess Bush has made in Iraq. This does not negate the fact that radical Islamists control much of the Middle East. Stop apologizing for thier barbaric laws and (self) destructive behavior.
posted by Wayne Besen, at
2/06/2006 12:50 PM
The worldwide radical element of Islam before the Iraq atrocities started was perhaps 10% of Islam, that is to say, 100 million Moslems.
How many more do you suppose the neocon atrocities against them have produced SINCE March, 2003? Only a complete fool would attempt to meet this much rage with force. But that is what has happened.
What steps can you point to that the neocons have taken to address the underlying reasons for all that Moslem hatred?
And now the neocon fools are threatening more and more the use of nuclear bombs against their target countries and are even now beginning to design a new hydrogen bomb.
posted by Anonymous, at
2/06/2006 6:16 PM
To 7:18 AM:
There's a Christian hymn that says "almost is not enough" or something like that.
Support for bigotry and atrocities against others is not enough. All your good will to others will never make it enough.
By the way, how many of the 250,000 dead Iraqis killed by Bush would Jesus kill? How many of the dead Iraqi children would Jesus kill?
posted by Anonymous, at
2/06/2006 6:28 PM
When the Islamic public is loudly and clearly outraged of the murderous and animalistic (yes, it is animalistic to murder in this way) activities of their own, they can be taken more seriously. When they understand that freedom of speech does not give the right to murder, they can be taken more seriously. I know many wonderful Muslims. Many. However the silence of the majority of the Muslim community supports the radicals in their behavior. It pretty much says that many of the quiet ones are living vicariously while pretending to be peace-loving. When they have Imams who preach murder, there is nothing sacred or spiritual about those Imams and little if anything spiritual about those who listen.
What's a real shame is that the US had to wait until the Towers were hit to start to gain some consciousness and Europe has to wait for something like this cartoon incident. You'd think the world would have joined in at a higher level to speak out against the cowardice barbarism of the Islamic Arabs when it was more confined to what the Palestinians were doing to the Jews. No one but the Jews really spoke out when the Christian Arabs were being mass murdered by the Muslim Arabs in Lebanon. Where were the voices. Thank goodness for something now, be it very, very late and rather costly.
I'm sure that many Arabs may miss the beauty in the following, though only if they choose to keep their eyes, ears and minds closed, and focus on punishing people for cartoons they may not like while ignoring the horrible cartooning that's accepted on somewhat daily basis in the Arab press against the Jews. The rest of you will discover or rediscover the beauty in these quotes by Golda Meir. They are so very, very true and so many more in the world are now allowing themselves to recognize it, helped unintentionally of course by Islamic extremists as well as by the silent Muslim world in the face of the extremism, for until the political leaders and the religious leaders in a predominantly Muslim country can rise to a level of consciousness and responsibility to actually tell their people to stop murdering others, and until parents there start to behave as parents and tell their children to stay home and start to instill some real values in them, this will continue. Please enjoy and pass along the following:
"I have given instructions that I be informed every time one of our soldiers is killed, even if it is in the middle of the night. When President Nasser leaves instructions that he is to be awakened in the middle of the night if an Egyptian soldier is killed, there will be peace." -Golda Meir
"Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us." -Golda Meir
"When peace comes we will perhaps in time be able to forgive the Arabs for killing our sons, but it will be harder for us to forgive them for having forced us to kill their sons." -Golda Meir
And so I ask, when will they (yes, I used the "they" word) learn to love their children more than they enjoy living in hatred of others? And will we ever be able to forgive them for what they're forcing us to become if we want to remain alive and protect our families?
posted by Anonymous, at
2/07/2006 11:14 PM
This came from another column, yet it fits the topic.
Having read through some of these comments, there's some really interesting thinking here along with some fascinating convolution leading to, of course, misconclusions, should such a word exist. And should it not, it fits here anyway.
My first piece of amusement came up when reading the person who said "I would prefer you use "religious outrage" etc, and go on to specify the details, rather than refer to "Muslims" or "Islamic"."
This IS about Islamic fundamentalism. It simply IS. Now if you'd like to comment on fundamentalism in general, feel free, but please don't smokescreen. And in case you're still confused, refer to the title at the top of the page. I'm sure you might be able to find some people discussing fundamentalism in general and try that approach with them. Fortunately someone else noted that "It is not Jews, Christians or any other group causing such world turmoil. It is Muslims who belong to specific violent sects. These are the hard facts. Political correctness does not change this reality." To this I will add that any time you put a modifier in front of the word correct, you've MODIFIED correct. It's either corrrect or it isn't.
Now here's a good one: "On the other hand many Muslims have organized and come out against terrorism, Clerics have come out against it, and American Muslim groups have also made their voice known on the issue." The author of this statement goes on to say "I love you Wayne, but I totally disagree with you on this one. Freedom of speech is a basic American right and protected by our Bill of Rights, but you cannot yell FIRE in a crowded theatre. Some of the Cartoons were funny, others were lame, and some where just stupid, and a few were downright offensive." This one's easy to take apart. First of all, it's nice that you love Wayne, but let's not feel that saying so - and in such a condescending way, I might add - makes your viewpoint any more or less legitimate. In this case, you're off. "Many" Muslim groups and clerics (Imams) have NOT organized or come out against terrorism. As a matter of indisputable fact, the huge MAJORITY of them have not, and those that have are whispering. Now let me infuse this with some facts that many people don't realize. When feeling enough pressure for many of them to finally make a statement against "terrorism," very few journalists pushed them to define terrorism or to state specifically that the attack on the Towers was terrorism. Let me now explain WHY. Because they don't consider that to be terrorism! There is a long explanation I could give you for this but right now suffice it to say that they do not consider non-Muslim victims of indiscrimate attacks such as what they did when attacking the Towers as innocent. Can you believe that? You probably can't. That, of course, doesn't change it from being the truth. If you want to find out for certain, ask some of them. Backed into a corner conversationally, most will admit it. And, you will then find out that they did not consider that terrorism. Yes, many will come out and say that they're against terrorism, however they know that you don't know what they consider terrorism to be. This is how they rationalize telling a lie (because they know what we are thinking when they use the word "terrorism") and telling themselves that they aren't lie. And they like it that way. This will anger some people. Some because they just found out. Others because they don't want to believe it. If you're in the second group, don't waste your time arguing with me. If your concern is truly being knowledgeable on this issue, ask some Muslims whom you trust to tell you the truth. And make sure you get a clear, accurate "yes" or "no" answer from them, not a vague evasion or non-response. Then you can talk to me if you want.
No one yelled "fire" in a "crowded theatre." The author of the comic simply took the same, although more restrained, approach that these very same people who are claiming outrage accept in their own publications. The preponderance of evidence is incontrovertible and, by the way, currently all over the internet. Thank goodness the rest of the world is finally glimpsing what the Arabs have kept to themselves about their inflammatory lies they tell in their press. Next, "funny...lame...stupid...downright offensive?" And your point? It's political satire. Give me a break. If you're going to write to make a point, it's best if you actually have one.
Moving further through these emails, the next statement that caught my eye was "While I share the outrage at these acts of violence, I don't believe that "force may be the only way to resolve the conflict", as this column suggests. Hasn't our use of military force in Iraq to "resolve conflicts" only resulted in greater violence and more terrorist "insurgents..."?
I agree. Force may not be the only way to resolve the conflict. But don't confuse "force" with "intelligent force." Intelligent force would probably have done a far superior job.
And then there's the person who said "The Danish paper threw a Molotov cocktail at Muslims. What else could you expect?" Again, it was no more - and far less - of a Molotov cocktail than what is accepted in the Arab/Muslim/Islamic publications. That's why they have no right to be indignant. And as far as your asking "what else can you expect?" Civilized decorum for one. Intelligent conversational exchange for two. I'll leave it to you to appropriately add to the list.
In completing my discourse of clarity in this picture, I'd like to respond to the person who finished by saying "In closing, I would not normally post anonymously -- to anything. I have said much more inflammatory things that these with my name and city at the bottom -- however, not when it involves friends who might, even though I did not name them, be somehow identified and made vulnerable -- particularly those that are still in places like Karachi, and therefore might end up hurt -- or dead." Well, I'm also posting anonymously. You may have said "much more inflammatory things" with your name and city, but Darlin', you probably said them to people who have a least a semblance of restraint and don't believe that if they kill you they'll be given 72 virgins, especially now that we've found out that they ran out up there is Islamic fundamentalist heaven. In other words, you didn't make your "much more inflammatory" statements in print with your name and address to Islamic extremists. You probably don't want to have to live like Salman Rushdie. (Google him up if you don't know what I mean. It's a real eye-opener.) More than that, you probably simply didn't want to be murdered. And if you were to ask your potential murderer and their friends and probably their family, too, believe it or not, it wouldn't have been murder. And it wouldn't have been terrorism. And they wouldn't have lost out on any more virgins.
When the Islamic public is loudly and clearly outraged of the murderous and animalistic (yes, it is animalistic to murder in this way) activities of their own, they can be taken more seriously. When they understand that freedom of speech does not give the right to murder, they can be taken more seriously. I know many wonderful Muslims. Many. However the silence of the majority of the Muslim community supports the radicals in their behavior. It pretty much says that many of the quiet ones are living vicariously while pretending to be peace-loving. When they have Imams who preach murder, there is nothing sacred or spiritual about those Imams and little if anything spiritual about those who listen.
What's a real shame is that the US had to wait until the Towers were hit to start to gain some consciousness and Europe has to wait for something like this cartoon incident. You'd think the world would have joined in at a higher level to speak out against the cowardice barbarism of the Islamic Arabs when it was more confined to what the Palestinians were doing to the Jews. No one but the Jews really spoke out when the Christian Arabs were being mass murdered by the Muslim Arabs in Lebanon. Where were the voices. Thank goodness for something now, be it very, very late and rather costly.
I'm sure that many Arabs may miss the beauty in the following, though only if they choose to keep their eyes, ears and minds closed, and focus on punishing people for cartoons they may not like while ignoring the horrible cartooning that's accepted on somewhat daily basis in the Arab press against the Jews. The rest of you will discover or rediscover the beauty in these quotes by Golda Meir. They are so very, very true and so many more in the world are now allowing themselves to recognize it, helped unintentionally of course by Islamic extremists as well as by the silent Muslim world in the face of the extremism, for until the political leaders and the religious leaders in a predominantly Muslim country can rise to a level of consciousness and responsibility to actually tell their people to stop murdering others, and until parents there start to behave as parents and tell their children to stay home and start to instill some real values in them, this will continue. Please enjoy and pass along the following:
"I have given instructions that I be informed every time one of our soldiers is killed, even if it is in the middle of the night. When President Nasser leaves instructions that he is to be awakened in the middle of the night if an Egyptian soldier is killed, there will be peace." -Golda Meir
"Peace will come when the Arabs will love their children more than they hate us." -Golda Meir
"When peace comes we will perhaps in time be able to forgive the Arabs for killing our sons, but it will be harder for us to forgive them for having forced us to kill their sons." -Golda Meir
And so I ask, when will they (yes, I used the "they" word) learn to love their children more than they enjoy living in hatred of others? And will we ever be able to forgive them for what they're forcing us to become if we want to remain alive and protect our families?
posted by Anonymous, at
2/08/2006 1:19 AM
Gracias a dios que no tengo dios. La verdad que los comentarios son un desastre. Acaso ¿no tienen ni dos neuronas en el cerebro? .Solo se ganan el odio con Bush (el mundo tendria que tener derecho a elegir el presidente de Estados Unidos). El pueblo de los Estados Unidos tiene que lamentar lo del 11 de Septiembre, que mueran soldados en Iraq pero acaso ¿saben hacer la paz?. Leave fanatism... from where i am, the fundamentalism and the imperialism are the same.
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